Are the US and Russia really enemies?

[Alonso]

According to most media, Russian, American, or from elsewhere, Russia and the US are rivals, even enemies. But I seem to remember having read in the old RODOH forum that both countries are actually controlled by the same people (the Illuminati, international Jewry or whatever they're called). At first, that didn't seem to make much sense. But the post in question claimed that it was the American deep state who brought Putin to power, using Henry Kissinger as their intermediary. To my big surprise, it turns out that Kissinger and Putin were indeed very good friends long before Putin rose to power. Which seems to strongly suggest that there's more to the US-Russia relation than meets the eye. Do you know anything about this?

I'm a regular reader of rt.com, and I tend to root for Russia, Iran, etc., in their conflicts with the US, Israel, etc. But I often have the uncomfortable feeling that I'm being duped. Specially when I read articles like this one, which use holyhoax propaganda to supposedly attack Israel and zionism.

[Archie]

It's not necessarily a static thing. The Americans could have supported him at one point but things can change.

I believe US media and diplomatic circles were fairly favorable toward Putin initially. It was probably not until around ~2008 or so that things started getting more adversarial. I would have to research it to reconstruct a proper timeline, but certainly by 2014 Putin had become a great villain in Western media.

The US has given Ukraine over $150 billion to fight against Russia, so I doubt very much that Putin and the US are secretly allied.

Russia definitely has their version of the Holocaust but it's a bit different than it is elsewhere. They are very bought in on WWII as a national myth. The "Great Patriotic War," they call it. Their glorious triumph over the fascist invaders.

[Alonso]

That's roughly the mainstream media account, and it might be correct. Not everything the mainstream media says are lies. But it's at least remarkable that Kissinger, arguably the most influential diplomat in American history, was (to the best of my knowledge) close friends with Putin since the early nineties, when Putin was just a city major, until Kissinger's death in 2023.

This topic seems to be related to the idea that there is a group of elites, sometimes called the Illuminati, who control the main governments of the world. Apparently, this idea was introduced by a Fritz Springmeier in his book "The Illuminati Formula Used to Create an Undetectable Total Mind Controlled Slave", which you can find here. A quick look at the book suggests it's not very grounded. Still, I know almost nothing about this kind of idea. Maybe I'm missing something.

Finally, the RT article I mentioned earlier is remarkable in a disturbing way. On the surface, it seems to be a very strong critique of Israel. It starts with a sensible metaphor that compares Israel and the Israeli government to a gang of mafia criminals. Then it briefly mentions some of the worst crimes those criminals have committed in recent times. So far, so good. But then it turns to orthodox zionist propaganda: "we now rightly celebrate those who openly stood up against the Nazis where they held power and committed their crimes, including a genocide of Jews". Is it possible that an author who sees the criminality of Israel so clearly, also completely fails to see the root of all that criminality, i.e., the holyhoax propaganda? It seems at least difficult to believe. They say you shouldn't attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity. But the author of this article doesn't seem stupid. He's a PhD. Which suggests that the only explanation left is malice.

The US has given Ukraine over $150 billion to fight against Russia, so I doubt very much that Putin and the US are secretly allied.

That's a strong point, and I can't think of any sensible counterpoint. Still, it doesn't seem to be enough to dispel the feeling that something doesn't quite add up.

[Wahrheitssucher]

According to most media (Russian, American, or from elsewhere), Russia and the US are rivals, even enemies. But I seem to remember having read …that both countries are actually controlled by the same people (…international Jewry…).

ALL ‘western’ countries have powerful and influential people CONTROLLING THEM who are either:
i.) self-identifying as belonging to an elite clique of international jews with shared policies of mutual self-interest;
OR
ii.) shabbat goyim who do their bidding for various reasons.

That also applies to Russia.
And it has applied to Russia since the end-times of the Russian monarchy, plus the elimination of the last Tsar’s entire family.
But I think Putin understands this and has been playing a clever, long game to slowly reduce that control and influence.

Summary:
international jewry have their fingers in EVERYONES’ pies.
No exception!
Errrrm…
well, that was besides the seven countries Gen. Wesley Clarke was told were planned for regime change by the jewish neo-cons.
[https://www.salon.com/2007/10/12/wesley_clark/]

They (the int. jews) have been trying to weaken, assassinate or remove Putin for decades as he’s been a big obstacle to their plans.
That’s what provoking him into invading Ukraine was all about.
The preparation for casting him as villain was what the Skripal and Litvinenko poisonings were all about.

They want Putin gone because he supported Assad (Syria) and still supports Iran militarily and economically.
Those two countries were great obstacles to zionist land-theft for Ersatz Israel and oil-production dominance, amongst other things. They (IJ) recently out-manoeuvred him on Syria and Lebanon. But Putin is currently now out-manoeuvring them on Iran.
It’s like a global game of geo-political chess.
One where the US and rest of Europe BESIDES Russia, are totally controlled by international jewry.

Cuba, N. Korea and Iran are what’s left of countries who have no international banks. Russia has them. Which is how control is leveraged.

Think about it!
If it were not so, and zio-jews internationally were NOT in control, how else could the Zionists get away with the ULTIMATE wicked crime of genocidal mass-murder for over two years. A viciously hateful and sadistic mass-murder of a defenceless, entrapped people that is CAPTURED ON FILM BY BRAGGING IOF soldiers?
They are not only getting away with it, but almost ALL western leaders have been supporting it and lying to their electorates about it.
How would that be possible otherwise?

At first, that didn't seem to make much sense. But the post in question claimed that it was the American deep state who brought Putin to power, using Henry Kissinger as their intermediary.

I have never seen any evidence of that.
Have you?
Please share if you have.
I think that is misinformation.

To my big surprise, it turns out that Kissinger and Putin were indeed very good friends long before Putin rose to power.

I have never seen any evidence of that either.
“…very good friends”??
And “BEFORE Putin rose to power”????
Nah. Don’t believe that.
I think that’s probably you reading someone repeating yet more, calculated misinformation!
Putin allegedly communicated with Kissinger occasionally over many years. And Putin gave condolences and praise to his widow after his death.
That’s it.
Both men used diplomacy and MSM like chess players / poker players.

Which seems to strongly suggest that there's more to the US-Russia relation than meets the eye. Do you know anything about this?

Putin was prepared as his successor by Boris Yeltsin on the recommendation of Valentin Yumashev. Not by Kissinger.

I'm a regular reader of rt.com,

So am I.
Sometimes I’m surprised why there is not stronger criticism of Israel and never any mention of Jewish power. But maybe that’s a long-view policy strategy to avoid what until recently could be the extremely damaging accusation of anti-semitism?

…and I tend to root for Russia, Iran, etc., in their conflicts with the US, Israel, etc. But I often have the uncomfortable feeling that I'm being duped. Specially when I read articles like this one, which use holyhoax propaganda to supposedly attack Israel and zionism.

First, that article is written by a German so by someone who has been more ‘brainwashed’ into believing holyhoax propaganda than people of any other nation.
Secondly, he was quoting a jew.
Thirdly, his use of holyH misinformation example is quite mild:
“Attacking Elbit, Israel's largest arms company, is, as [jewish] investigative journalist Max Blumenthal put it, the contemporary equivalent of sabotaging the railway lines to Auschwitz…”

[Alonso]

Hey, Wahrheitssucher, I've found your post very interesting. It touches on several topics I've always been interested in but never understood very well (or at all).

it has applied to Russia since the end-times of the Russian monarchy, plus the elimination of the last Tsar’s entire family.

That seems to mean that the Russian Revolution was created by IJ and the Soviet Union was controlled by IJ. However, you've also said that IJ controls Western countries, which were, at least in theory, the enemies of the Soviet Union. It's not the first time I hear this idea, but I don't understand how it would work.

I think Putin understands this and has been playing a clever, long game to slowly reduce that control and influence.

Yet Putin keeps repeating the holyhoax lies as fervently as IJ. And those lies are the main pillar that supports the power of IJ. Why help his enemies in this way? If he really wants to reduce their influence, shouldn't he start by exposing their lies?

Putin ... still supports Iran militarily and economically.

Not so much, it seems. RT does support Iran ideologically and denounce the West routinely. But when it comes to actual military support, Russian officials seems allergic to even consider the idea.

Putin is currently now out-manoeuvring them on Iran.

How? Once again, when it comes to actual action (as opposed to mere ideological support), there seems to be very little from the Russian side. Which is understandable, they have more than their fair share to deal with in Ukraine. But I can't see how he's out-manoeuvring anybody when there doesn't seem to be any action from Russia at all.

almost ALL western leaders have been supporting it and lying to their electorates about it.

Yup. That much I'm aware of.

At first, that didn't seem to make much sense. But the post in question claimed that it was the American deep state who brought Putin to power, using Henry Kissinger as their intermediary.

I have never seen any evidence of that.
Have you?
Please share if you have.

Here. That's the Kremlin archives quoting Putin directly. It doesn't get much more reliable than that. Putin's quote (addressing Kissinger in 2012):

As for our personal relations, they began while I was working as deputy mayor of St Petersburg, back in the mid-1990s. You came here as the head of the Russian-American commission. I am very glad that we have maintained these relations to this day.

his use of holyH misinformation example is quite mild:
“Attacking Elbit, Israel's largest arms company, is, as [jewish] investigative journalist Max Blumenthal put it, the contemporary equivalent of sabotaging the railway lines to Auschwitz…”

Actually, the article includes much stronger holyhoax propaganda, as I quoted in my second post: "we now rightly celebrate those who openly stood up against the Nazis where they held power and committed their crimes, including a genocide of Jews".

[Wahrheitssucher]

Hey, Wahrheitssucher, I've found your post very interesting. It touches on several topics I've always been interested in but never understood very well (or at all).

it has applied to Russia since the end-times of the Russian monarchy, plus the elimination of the last Tsar’s entire family.

That seems to mean that the Russian Revolution was created by IJ and the Soviet Union was controlled by IJ. However, you've also said that IJ controls Western countries, which were, at least in theory, the enemies of the Soviet Union. It's not the first time I hear this idea, but I don't understand how it would work.

IJ make sure they can control WHOEVER is in power. So they don’t just infiltrate, bribe, blackmail BOTH SIDES of any issue, but any possible replacement ‘sides’. They make sure they have infiltrators; bribed, ambitious, willing partners; compromised puppet/poodles; etc.; in every discussion, contest, political arena, etc.
It is called ‘controlled opposition’.
In America Bernie Sanders is an example of it.
Jill Stein may be another.
These people may now start to make statements thatvare very critical of Israel but it is in order to be able to gain support, win votes, to win elections and thus control government should electorates want radical change. This way — with such ‘controlled opposition’ types — IJ will STILL retain control and power, whoever gets elected.

In the UK Zak Polanski is a good example of it: gay, Green and critical of Israel …PLUS jewish!

Gilad Atzmon appears to be yet another example of pre-planned ‘controlled opposition’ already in place.
Think about it! He is someone who has PUBLICLY renounced his Israeli citizenship AND his Judaic self-identification and is a published author talking about ‘jewish power’!!!!
He even criticises the holyH mythology.
Yet here is the give-away: he never gets the sort of public crucifixion, ostracisation and public smearing that a non-Jew would get for the same behaviour.
PLUS — despite being a socialist and Labour Party member — when he was needed by the zionists, he became an extremely vocal critic of Jeremy Corbyn in order to prevent his very narrowly missed election victories that would have made him UK Primeminister.

Bernie Sanders is a closet zionist.
So is Noam Chomsky.
So is…
Etc., etc.

Regarding Russia, look at the example of a jewish arch-capitalist who supported the communists. The Russian revolution was funded by this Jewish banker and industrialist called Jacob Schiff who was a German from Frankfurt. He financed the Japanese military efforts against Tsarist Russia in their war of 1904-1905. He was the foremost Jewish banker from 1880 to 1920 in what later became known as the ‘Schiff era’, and he was heavily involved in all major Jewish issues of that time, including the rise of Zionism.
I’ve heard jewish Stephen Fry reject the notion of Jewish capitalists supporting the communists as a ludicrous and illogical self-contradiction.
Yeah, well then explain Schiff!

I think Putin understands this and has been playing a clever, long game to slowly reduce that control and influence.

Yet Putin keeps repeating the holyhoax lies as fervently as IJ. And those lies are the main pillar that supports the power of IJ. Why help his enemies in this way? If he really wants to reduce their influence, shouldn't he start by exposing their lies?

No, certainly not. And definitely not THAT particular lie. That is still career suicide — even for top politicians.

E.g. Scottish parliamentarian and journalist George Galloway is a very courageous and fiercely critical opponent of Israel, yet he also repeats the holyH lies.
PLUS he is a friend of Gilad Atzmon who has exposed many of the most obvious holyH lies, so George must know his exposé of all that. Yet George continues referring to those lies and promoting them as if he didn’t know.
I assume both Putin and Galloway KNOW that they would be too easily vilified and weakened if they took on THAT holyH deception too.

Putin ... still supports Iran militarily and economically.

Not so much, it seems. RT does support Iran ideologically and denounce the West routinely. But when it comes to actual military support, Russian officials seems allergic to even consider the idea.

Not so openly NOW. But yes Russia supplies weaponry, aircraft, military technology, advanced defence systems and training to Iran, plus they did so for Assad’s Syria.
Those shipments are maybe less open now so as not to be able to be targeted by the jews who control Trump and the USA, for being complicit in the Iranian attacks against US bases in the Gulf region.

Weaponry has been secretly transported via the Caspian Sea (which is really a collosal lake, not a sea).
Here’s an image from 3 years ago accusing Iran of transportation going the other way.
It appears to be a clandestine, two-way traffic:


Plus it is assumed that Russia (and China) have being secretly supplying Iran with intelligence. Extremely advanced satellite intelligence which Iran doesn’t have. That is presumably how Iran has been able to pinpoint their missile attacks to very precise military targets and to Israeli leadership personnel.

Putin is currently now out-manoeuvring them on Iran.

How? Once again, when it comes to actual action (as opposed to mere ideological support), there seems to be very little from the Russian side. Which is understandable, they have more than their fair share to deal with in Ukraine. But I can't see how he's out-manoeuvring anybody when there doesn't seem to be any action from Russia at all.

See above reply. Israel control USA and without them and US support Israel is finished. Well once the trade in oil switches from the American petro-dollar to the Chinese petro-Yuan, then America is finished as THE great super-power. Alliances and allegiances will very quickly recalibrate AWAY from the dollar and American influence and thus US prosperity will rapidly decline.
With Iran recognising they are now in an existential crisis — and so deciding to resist or die as an independent sovereign nation — we have for the first time since the cold war a country refusing to bow to USrael blackmail and attempt at dominance. USrael have therefore ALREADY LOST.
They gambled one time too many. They thought Iranian leadership would buckle and surrender OR the suffering Iranian people would revolt and force a surrender via regime change.
That failed.
The Iranian people are now MORE aligned with their leadership and fiercely loyal than before the murder by Trump on Bibi’s orders, of their leader Seyed Al-Khamenei.

Russia and Putin are now helping Iran to maintain the Iranian resistance to USrael bombardment and Iranian control of the Strait of Hormuz.
With that Hormuz stranglehold — even if crazy Trump won’t give up — the rest of the world’s zio-controlled leaders will eventually HAVE to side with Iran, to avoid regime change in their own countries.
Spain has already done so. They were the first to do that.
Italy and France are now making similar noises and cancelling strategic alliances.
Now Turkey is becoming extremely vocal AGAINST the fake-joo, ashkenazi, atheistic, psychopathic, zio-ethno-state.

All countries worldwide depend on shipments through the Iran-controlled Strait.
And NOW all countries aligned with USrael are being forbidden passage by Iran.
So, with the closure of Hormuz for Usrael-puppet countries, plus the new toll for passage (if permitted) in Chinese Yuan, plus the switch to dealings in oil in Chinese-Yuan instead of US-dollars, this has all been supported and encouraged by Putin and it ALL favours and benefits Putin. And now energy-strapped Europeans are lifting their sanctions on Russian oil out of necessity, Russia is making a killing both politically abd financially. He’s played the situation excellently.
Do you see?

almost ALL western leaders have been supporting it and lying to their electorates about it.

Yup. That much I'm aware of.

I have never seen any evidence of that.
Have you?
Please share if you have.

Here. That's the Kremlin archives quoting Putin directly. It doesn't get much more reliable than that. Putin's quote (addressing Kissinger in 2012):

As for our personal relations, they began while I was working as deputy mayor of St Petersburg, back in the mid-1990s. You came here as the head of the Russian-American commission. I am very glad that we have maintained these relations to this day.

I think that’s just diplomacy, not signs of a “very close friendship”.