Archaeological Evidence of Mass Graves at Treblinka II

[Nazgul]

Wiernik stated Katyn was the reason why the Nazis started to exhume and cremate corpses.

The government of Nazi Germany announced the discovery of mass graves in the Katyn Forest in April 1943.
Wiernik was in Treblinka during this announcement and escaped during the uprising of 2 August 1943. He would have no knowledge of Katyn except from hearsay when he joined the Warsaw resistance.

[joshk246]

Indeed, the camp was demolished, planted over, and left guarded. All by the Nazis. What were they doing there? Why did they use excavators? Why did Soviet bombs uncover so many human remains?

Why did Soviet bombs uncover so many human remains?

“so many”, not a single complete body.

It was the Nazi intention to leave no complete corpses, to prevent a body count, as was managed at Katyn. The grave robbing and use of explosives, made finding whole corpses even less likely.

Have you made any effort to read up on the history of the camp?

Have you made any effort to read up on the history of the camp?

No need to be snarky, as bombsaway said, you’re trying your best.
Yes, I know what is claimed.
All the preposterous outdoor cremation nonsense.

[Nessie]

Wiernik stated Katyn was the reason why the Nazis started to exhume and cremate corpses.

The government of Nazi Germany announced the discovery of mass graves in the Katyn Forest in April 1943.
Wiernik was in Treblinka during this announcement and escaped during the uprising of 2 August 1943. He would have no knowledge of Katyn except from hearsay when he joined the Warsaw resistance.

In the next post, a revisionist source dates the start of cremations to April 1943. Wienik said he heard about Katyn whilst at the camp.

[Nessie]

....
Yes, I know what is claimed.
All the preposterous outdoor cremation nonsense.

Just because so-called revisionists cannot believe pyres were possible, because of their calculations about the wood needed, does not evidence there were no mass graves.

[joshk246]

....
Yes, I know what is claimed.
All the preposterous outdoor cremation nonsense.

[quote=joshk246 post_id=11918 time=<a href="tel:1751817266">1751817266</a> user_id=167]
....
Yes, I know what is claimed.
All the preposterous outdoor cremation nonsense.

Just because so-called revisionists cannot believe pyres were possible, because of their calculations about the wood needed, does not evidence there were no mass graves.

Roughly how much dry wood(kg) do you need to cremate a corpse, Nessie?

[bombsaway]

....
Yes, I know what is claimed.
All the preposterous outdoor cremation nonsense.

[quote=joshk246 post_id=11918 time=<a href="tel:1751817266">1751817266</a> user_id=167]
....
Yes, I know what is claimed.
All the preposterous outdoor cremation nonsense.

Just because so-called revisionists cannot believe pyres were possible, because of their calculations about the wood needed, does not evidence there were no mass graves.

Roughly how much dry wood(kg) do you need to cremate a corpse, Nessie?

this question is a diversion from the archeological evidence, the point of the thread

the archeological evidence, based on the immediate post war survey, indicates mass burial and body destruction

most of the camp is now forested, so the GPR scans of the non-forested parts do not allow us to set a limit on maximum amount of grave space in the camp

[joshk246]

Just because so-called revisionists cannot believe pyres were possible, because of their calculations about the wood needed, does not evidence there were no mass graves.

Roughly how much dry wood(kg) do you need to cremate a corpse, Nessie?

this question is a diversion from the archeological evidence, the point of the thread

the archeological evidence, based on the immediate post war survey, indicates mass burial and body destruction

most of the camp is now forested, so the GPR scans of the non-forested parts do not allow us to set a limit on maximum amount of grave space in the camp

this question is a diversion from the archeological evidence, the point of the thread

The mass graves rely on the cremation fairytale being true.
No cremations = No mass graves.

I’ll concede it’s a slight diversion off topic, this thread has become very repetitive.

[Stubble]

It was the Nazi intention to leave no complete corpses, to prevent a body count, as was managed at Katyn. The grave robbing and use of explosives, made finding whole corpses even less likely.

The Staff in the area would know nothing about Katyn. Bombs do explode but are not really explosives as you mention.

Wiernik stated Katyn was the reason why the Nazis started to exhume and cremate corpses.

I'm going to drop a rather hot take here based on the use of pyres by the German Authorities during ww2.

These outdoor burnings were hygienic in nature and stemmed from a very real need to prevent groundwater contamination. It also controlled odor and any pestilence that could have resulted from the rotting of corpses.

There are extant photographs of these pyres and fuel is minimal. Look at the Dresden pyre photographs for example. This is because the goal was desiccation of the corpses, not destruction. When you look at the Kola study for example, this is borne out by the evidence. Not even destruction of hair was complete, what's less tissue.

I suspect that after the groundwater contamination at Auschwitz from the mass grave there (a result of a typhus outbreak and lack of cremation capacity), a general order was issued by the German Authorities to exhume the grave space at the transit camps and desiccate the bodies, then to bury them again.

If the goal had been destruction, to cover evidence, Kola would have drawn up ash and sand only in his sampling apparatus, not teeth, soft tissue, hair etc.

If Aktion 1005 was the complete obliteration of the remains of an extermination program, then, as evidenced by Kola, it was an absolute failure.

Long and short of it, however many bodies were buried at Treblinka II, are, more or less, still buried at Treblinka II. Except for bodies removed by the Soviet after bombing or by the Polish Authorities.

[TlsMS93]

Mass cremations do not indicate that these people were murdered, Dresden makes that very clear. Until they give me the ashes corresponding to 800,000 bodies, I will never accept your Holocaust, Jewish myths should stay with Jews.

[Stubble]

Mass cremations do not indicate that these people were murdered, Dresden makes that very clear. Until they give me the ashes corresponding to 800,000 bodies, I will never accept your Holocaust, Jewish myths should stay with Jews.

I mean, we mostly agree, but, the people of Dresden were murdered. The open air burning of their bodies on pyres after the incineration by allied bombing had nothing to do with their murder however, and was a completely hygienic measure.

[TlsMS93]

I mean, we mostly agree, but, the people of Dresden were murdered. The open air burning of their bodies on pyres after the incineration by allied bombing had nothing to do with their murder however, and was a completely hygienic measure.

We mean in the sense that the Germans cremated the bodies in Dresden not to hide anything criminal on their part. The mere fact that these Reinhardt camps did not have conventional crematoriums is already a big hole in the event.