An exposition, Made in Russia, The Holocaust

[Stubble]

Auschwitz-Birkenau was a stop off and they went to other camps, maybe registered at buna for example, all over the place.

Hell, look at what happened with Zisblatt...

I don't really care about Zisblatt, unless you can show she's connected to some broader conspiracy. You mentioned masturbation machines, that's from the book Stolen Soul, which was made up by a gentile pretending to be a Jew https://www.theguardian.com/books/2008/mar/03/news.film

I care more about documents and contemporaneous testimonies. The issue you w the Polish death camps is and general Jewish population is what happened to the non-employable Jews.

Goebbels in his "liquidated" entry says they made up 60%. Statistics exist for those who actually came to Auschwitz

In a report dated May 26, 1944 Eberhard von Thadden, an expert on Jews within the German Foreign Ministry, wrote: [44]

»According to the observations so far, about 1/3 of the deported Jews are able to work. They are immediately after their arrival in the camp Auschwitz distributed to the agencies of Gauleiter Sauckel, the OT [Organization Todt] etc.«

»According to the experiences so far these transports will consist of an estimated 30% (in this case about 3,600) employable Jews […]«

from here https://codoh.com/library/document/the- ... july-1944/

This article deals with the question What happened to the Jews who were deported to Auschwitz but not registered there?”

And yet

What was the fate of the Non-Employable Hungarian Jews?
At the present level of knowledge we cannot answer this question with certainty supported by documents.

So this is the issue, this is the population thought to have been killed.

So far, I haven't turned up final disposition.

Best documentation I have access to that supports the idea they weren't gassed is memoranda about the need for extra requisition of soap, a need to launder undergarments more than once every 10 weeks, requisition for extra medical supplies specifically for unregistered internees and memoranda about their disheveled state on arrival at another camp (a train load, not all train loads, I'm not saying this document by itself proves all train loads were transited, because it is one exchange of memos from 2 camps and administration about 1 train load).

[bombsaway]

Auschwitz-Birkenau was a stop off and they went to other camps, maybe registered at buna for example, all over the place.

Hell, look at what happened with Zisblatt...

I don't really care about Zisblatt, unless you can show she's connected to some broader conspiracy. You mentioned masturbation machines, that's from the book Stolen Soul, which was made up by a gentile pretending to be a Jew https://www.theguardian.com/books/2008/mar/03/news.film

I care more about documents and contemporaneous testimonies. The issue you w the Polish death camps is and general Jewish population is what happened to the non-employable Jews.

Goebbels in his "liquidated" entry says they made up 60%. Statistics exist for those who actually came to Auschwitz

In a report dated May 26, 1944 Eberhard von Thadden, an expert on Jews within the German Foreign Ministry, wrote: [44]

»According to the observations so far, about 1/3 of the deported Jews are able to work. They are immediately after their arrival in the camp Auschwitz distributed to the agencies of Gauleiter Sauckel, the OT [Organization Todt] etc.«

»According to the experiences so far these transports will consist of an estimated 30% (in this case about 3,600) employable Jews […]«

from here https://codoh.com/library/document/the- ... july-1944/

This article deals with the question What happened to the Jews who were deported to Auschwitz but not registered there?”

And yet

What was the fate of the Non-Employable Hungarian Jews?
At the present level of knowledge we cannot answer this question with certainty supported by documents.

So this is the issue, this is the population thought to have been killed.

So far, I haven't turned up final disposition.

Best documentation I have access to that supports the idea they weren't gassed is memoranda about the need for extra requisition of soap, a need to launder undergarments more than once every 10 weeks, requisition for extra medical supplies specifically for unregistered internees and memoranda about their disheveled state on arrival at another camp (a train load, not all train loads, I'm not saying this document by itself proves all train loads were transited, because it is one exchange of memos from 2 camps and administration about 1 train load).

I think the point to show you is there is a stark gap for Auschwitz whereas the vast majority of those sent to Dachau and Majdanek.

It should go without saying at this point that revisionists don't have direct evidence for their main assertions, which for the record are conspiracy to fabricate evidence and also that non employable Jews were somehow maintained. Those records for soap show they were maintaining laborers, which yes orthodoxy agrees happened.

[Stubble]

I don't really care about Zisblatt, unless you can show she's connected to some broader conspiracy. You mentioned masturbation machines, that's from the book Stolen Soul, which was made up by a gentile pretending to be a Jew https://www.theguardian.com/books/2008/mar/03/news.film

I care more about documents and contemporaneous testimonies. The issue you w the Polish death camps is and general Jewish population is what happened to the non-employable Jews.

Goebbels in his "liquidated" entry says they made up 60%. Statistics exist for those who actually came to Auschwitz





from here https://codoh.com/library/document/the- ... july-1944/

This article deals with the question What happened to the Jews who were deported to Auschwitz but not registered there?”

And yet


So this is the issue, this is the population thought to have been killed.

So far, I haven't turned up final disposition.

Best documentation I have access to that supports the idea they weren't gassed is memoranda about the need for extra requisition of soap, a need to launder undergarments more than once every 10 weeks, requisition for extra medical supplies specifically for unregistered internees and memoranda about their disheveled state on arrival at another camp (a train load, not all train loads, I'm not saying this document by itself proves all train loads were transited, because it is one exchange of memos from 2 camps and administration about 1 train load).

I think the point to show you is there is a stark gap for Auschwitz whereas the vast majority of those sent to Dachau and Majdanek.

It should go without saying at this point that revisionists don't have direct evidence for their main assertions, which for the record are conspiracy to fabricate evidence and also that non employable Jews were somehow maintained. Those records for soap show they were maintaining laborers, which yes orthodoxy agrees happened.

Actually, no, the soap memoranda specifically address non employable Hungarian jews and there is a link provided in the article you linked.

/shrug

Part of the reason for the kerfuffle between exterminationists and revisionists on these sticking points, is that there is a lack of sufficient evidence for either position to be asserted as congruent with the events that transpired.

From the revisionist perspective, what is the point of giving medical aid to a 78 year old Hungarian jew before gassing him? Where is the logic in that?

There are plenty of other rabbit holes.

That said, the murder weapon is missing for your assertion. If you are going to say '1.1 million jews were gassed in Auschwitz Birkenau', you should be able to show me where it was done and explain how. Explain the lack of direct physical evidence.

Surely killing 1.1 million people in 'gas chambers disguised as shower rooms' would leave evidence, like, hydrogen cyanide residue in the 'homicidal gas chambers' for example.

Then there is the insanity of it. A genocide where you don't genocide everyone, but you transport them some place and weigh them and pick one from here or there and waste valuable time, resources and manpower to do so.

Rather than, you know, genociding these people in their tents with machetes.

/shrug

To place the burden solely on revisionists to evidence what happened is unfair. You have a responsibility in your position to illustrate it as well.

Providing soap for and medical care to unregistered Hungarian jews at Auschwitz Birkenau and the Auschwitz complexes is not gassing the unregistered Hungarian jew.

Transporting the unregistered Hungarian jews to other camps is not gassing the unregistered Hungarian jews.

Speaking to providing better living conditions to the unregistered Hungarian jews is not gassing the unregistered Hungarian jews.

It just isn't.

More to the point about evidencing, the presentation in the original post covers the manufacture of documents and their introduction into evidence in a very concise way and with a myriad of examples.

[bombsaway]

Orthodoxy does not hold that medical care was provided to people who were immediately gassed, that's a straw man. Juveniles (under 18) could be used for work, why do read them as non employable? Elderly Jews could be used as well, depending on skill set. Doctors eg were useful . The closest you come to non employable being accepted were those used for medical.experiments (mattogno wonders why so many children who were twins were accepted). Some super wealthy Jews also were held for purposes of extracting ransom. In any case these exceptions are so few, if you looked at the big picture rather than micro focusing you see they don't come close to filling the gap, whereas in these other camps they do. There are no "missing Jews" at Dachau. There are like a million at Auschwitz, even Mattogno admits most of the Hungarian Jews are totally unaccounted for.

[Stubble]

Orthodoxy does not hold that medical care was provided to people who were immediately gassed, that's a straw man. Juveniles (under 18) could be used for work, why do read them as non employable? Elderly Jews could be used as well, depending on skill set. Doctors eg were useful . The closest you come to non employable being accepted were those used for medical.experiments (mattogno wonders why so many children who were twins were accepted). Some super wealthy Jews also were held for purposes of extracting ransom. In any case these exceptions are so few, if you looked at the big picture rather than micro focusing you see they don't come close to filling the gap, whereas in these other camps they do. There are no "missing Jews" at Dachau. There are like a million at Auschwitz, even Mattogno admits most of the Hungarian Jews are totally unaccounted for.

I was just going by the unemployable classification given to them. I wasn't asserting that a child or elderly Hungarian jew was unemployable simply because of age.

Just going by classification.

Again, this stuff is covered in the article you linked.

These rabbit trails are in that article specifically.

/shrug

I'm not making this stuff up or presenting it in some dishonest way. I'm just pointing at it and highlighting the inconsistency.

[Numar Patru]

Wasn’t it Emerson who said consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds?

[Stubble]

Is that an off hand half hearted insult?

How feminine.

Got anything to address the meat and potatoes of this?

[Numar Patru]

Feminine?

[Stubble]

Feminine?

Correct. Further the full quote is 'foolish consistency'.

I digress.

Anything to comment to the crux of the conversation rather than this prattle?

[Numar Patru]

Still wondering what makes my remark “feminine.”

My point, since you missed it, is that inconsistencies aren’t necessarily as big a deal as you lot make about them, particularly when they typically center around details rather than core aspects of the history.

[Stubble]

Still wondering what makes my remark “feminine.”

My point, since you missed it, is that inconsistencies aren’t necessarily as big a deal as you lot make about them, particularly when they typically center around details rather than core aspects of the history.

These details are direct refutations of the orthodox thesis simply by existing. Also, we are talking about 'unemployable Hungarian jews' being billeted in the isolation wings. That specifically indicates not gassed on arrival.

This isn't trivial.

[Numar Patru]

I don’t see this soap document reproduced here. Is it available?

[Stubble]

I don’t see this soap document reproduced here. Is it available?

There is a link in the article linked by Bombsaway in the references.

[bombsaway]

Stubble, you said Actually, no, the soap memoranda specifically address non employable Hungarian jews and there is a link provided in the article you linked.

And it doesn't, only juvenile, which doesn't necessarily mean non employable

[Stubble]

It indicates 2 groups. Block 8 and block 12. Juveniles are referenced. If I have made an undue leap about them being unemployable, which is possible, I apologize. That said, that's how I read it.

I can't see isolating 'employable jews' for 8 to 10 weeks though, can you? I also feel for them. I change my boxers daily.