Wetzelrad wrote: ↑Sat Dec 06, 2025 2:59 am
Nessie wrote: ↑Fri Dec 05, 2025 1:39 pm
Alien abduction witnesses, corroborate each other, but there is no other evidence to corroborate them. They are also making claims that are physically impossible to have happened.
Mass gassing witnesses, corroborate each other and there is other evidence to corroborate them. They are also making claims that are physically possible to have happened.
Lol. Alien truthers and gassing truthers have about the same level of corroboration. In both cases the photos, the documents, and the physical locations are utterly ordinary.
I would not call three AR camps, that were razed to the ground and left guarded, because of the huge areas of disturbed ground, containing cremated remains, utterly ordinary. What other camps were left like that?
A video of a blinking light in the sky which we are supposed to believe is an alien vehicle has about as much corroborative value as a blueprint of a delousing gas chamber which we are supposed to believe was "authentic proof" of human gassings. A crop circle in a field has about as much corroborative value as the Soviet Mound of Ashes, which is merely a hill of dirt.
Of course alien truthers refer in some cases to real locations and events. A forest or a park or a residence is a real place that can be accurately described from memory and therefore corroborate that specific memory. But if you were to say that it corroborates alien contact I would have to regard you as insane.
As to gassing witnesses, the vast majority -- if not the entirety -- of these witnesses are plainly refuted by the physical and documentary evidence as well as each other.
Eyewitnesses describe mass arrivals. Documents record mass arrivals. How is that the documentary evidence refuting the witnesses? What eyewitnesses refute each other? What physical evidence refutes them?
As for physical possibility, what they claimed is almost universally impossible. Diesel gassings, instantaneous gassings, instantaneous ventilation, Zyklon through shower heads, 5-minute cremations, etc. You've repeatedly avoided confronting these simple scientific facts, which shows you're just not serious about this debate.
That is a fabrication on your part. I get criticised for being repetitive, as I repeatedly explain the diesel etc claims, by discussing the difference between hearsay and eyewitness evidence and how memory, recall and other factors affect the testimony. You then refuse to engage with any studies about witnesses, as you want to pretend that your argument from incredulity, about physical impossibility, is legitimate.
Instead you try to excuse impossibilities with logical blunders like this one:
Nessie wrote: ↑Wed Dec 03, 2025 4:09 pm
You can illogically argue it was not possible, based on what ever calculations you want to make, or believe, all you want. Since it is evidenced and proven to have happened, then logically, it was possible.
I suspect that this fallacious logic would be out of place even among alien truthers, yet it is a standard rationale for Holocaust believers. Your statement neatly echoes this amusing classic quote from Pierre Vidal Naquet and thirty three other defenders of the narrative in 1979:
It is not necessary to ask oneself how, technically, such a mass murder was possible. It was technically possible because it happened.
That position is logically and evidentially correct. If something is proven to have happened, it stands to reason it was possible to happen. Just because you cannot work out, to your satisfaction, how it happened, does not prove it did not happen.
But any objective thinker can see that this makes the evidence dependent on the conclusion instead of the other way around.
No, the conclusion is derived from the evidence. Multiple eyewitnesses say gas chambers killed people at A-B. There is documentary, physical and circumstantial evidence to corroborate the eyewitnesses. Gassings are then proven.
You then come along and announce that since you cannot work out how the gassings could have been possible, that proves they did not happen and all the eyewitnesses lied. That argument is logically flawed. You then fail to evidence and prove what did happen instead.
As well, that by removing the boundaries of physics from what is possible that you will and do excuse confronting
any and every refutation. So, if I were to show you that bodies physically cannot be cremated at the rates claimed by the eyewitnesses because there has
never been a cremation of an adult corpse in 10 minutes, you would insist that it is
possible because it happened.
Wrong. I would point to reasons why that 10 minutes is wrong and the evidence that the corpses were in the ovens for at least 30 mnutes. I would explain the studies that show we are poor at estimating how long something took to happen, as a potential reason why witness made clear mistakes about how long cremations took. I would not and have never insisted that cremations took 10 minutes, you made that falsehood up.
It is because you ignore the studied about estimating time, that you take claims about 10 minute cremations, literally. You think if a witness claims 10 minutes, that is evidence of a lie. Those who have studied witnesses, know that it is better explained by an underestimation of time.
"AI Overview
We're often bad at estimating how long things take due to optimism and incomplete planning...We tend to underestimate task duration, focusing on ideal conditions rather than potential delays."
https://fullfocus.co/the-science-of-gauging-time/
"We aren’t just bad at estimating task duration. We specifically and predictably underestimate how long a task will take to complete."
Now do you see that it is likely the eyewitnesses, when asked, often years later, how long did the cremations take, that they underestimated the length of time, and that explains the 10 minute claim?