Why Do you Guys Think the Holocaust is Fake?

[Keen]

I didn't calculate the estimates myself and I don't really see how it matters whether it was 4 million or 6 million.

What about 2 million, would it matter then?

If the number realy was 4 million, then that means that the actual number is exagerated by 50 percent.

Do you think it matters to the people who are or who have been put in prison for stating the fact that the 6 million figure is an exageration?

Remember, the claim that 2.1 million jews were buried in "huge mass graves" at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and TII has been debunked by the convergence of the lack of physical evidence method, the 4 million figure at Auschwitz has been reduced from 4 million to 1 million (at the very least), the Majdanek figure has been reduced from 2 million down to 42 thousand, and the figure for Mauthausen has been reduced from 2 million down to 38 thousand, etc., etc., etc.

Again, the actual figure matters to those sitting in prison for simply speaking the truth.

So how dare you, you POS, for saying that it doesn't matter.

[Keen]

So here are my two main questions.

Lol! Sudenly CJ, who couldn't bring himself to answer a single yes or no question, has questions himself!

1. If the number of missing Jews was less than 5.1m, why do you think that?

2. How do you account for the number of missing Jews after the war since the possibility of emigration doesn't seem to come remotely close?

Define "missing." (funny, earlier you alleged that they had "disapeared.")

So is this a missing person issue CJ, or a murder issue?

Earlier you alleged that there was a massive amount of evidence that jews were murdered. Why are you moving the goal posts?

CJ:

nothing matters except the truth.

So do you condem those who put people behind bars for telling the truth that the holohoax is, at the veryleast, an exageration?

[ConfusedJew]

I didn't calculate the estimates myself and I don't really see how it matters whether it was 4 million or 6 million.

Do you think it matters to the people who are or who have been put in prison for stating the fact that the 6 million figure is an exageration?

Remember, the claim that 2.1 million jews were buried in "huge mass graves" at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and TII has been debunked by the convergence of the lack of physical evidence method, the 4 million figure at Auschwitz has been reduced from 4 million to 1 million (at the very least), the Majdanek figure has been reduced from 2 million down to 42 thousand, and the figure for Mauthausen has been reduced from 2 million down to 38 thousand, etc., etc., etc.

Again, the actual figure matters to those sitting in prison for simply speaking the truth.

So how dare you, you POS, for saying that it doesn't matter.

In the United States, where I live, there are no laws sending you to prison for Holocaust denial or minimization.

When you get to the levels of 5 million or 6 million, it's just a statistic at that point. I don't believe those numbers are "exaggerated", but maybe some people "exaggerated", whatever that means. Based on my research so far, it seems like you could pretty easily defend 6 million in front of a reasonable audience.

You've called me a POS and inaccurately accused me of lying, so I'm less inclined to respond to you, but I will give you another chance if you are willing to be civil.

I personally disagree that people are speaking "the truth" when they say things like that, but it may be "their truth". That's my opinion at least.

I can't think of any reason off the top of my head as to why society might want to imprison people just for trying to speak "their truth", but I guess it depends on what their motivation is. If their intention is not good, then they might just want to abuse another person, even if they are speaking truth.

I don't get why people are so fixated on this though. I understand if you believe there was no genocide, but if you just think the numbers are exaggerated, why do people spend so much effort trying to prove that to the world? How does it benefit them by doing that?

[ConfusedJew]

So do you condem those who put people behind bars for telling the truth that the holohoax is, at the veryleast, an exageration?

Will you show me an example of a specific person or a few people who were put in prison for denying the holocaust? In general, it's not great practice to condemn anything unless you are very clear about what it is that you are condemning. I would want to look at the specific reasons that they were put in prison and what specific laws they violated.

[Keen]

CJ:

It matters whether it was 4 million or 6 million.

When you get to the levels of 5 million or 6 million, it's just a statistic at that point.

Tell that to Ursala Haverbeck.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/95-old-germa ... 39699.html

[Keen]

I didn't calculate the estimates myself and I don't really see how it matters whether it was 4 million or 6 million.

Do you think it matters to the people who are or who have been put in prison for stating the fact that the 6 million figure is an exageration?

Remember, the claim that 2.1 million jews were buried in "huge mass graves" at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and TII has been debunked by the convergence of the lack of physical evidence method, the 4 million figure at Auschwitz has been reduced from 4 million to 1 million (at the very least), the Majdanek figure has been reduced from 2 million down to 42 thousand, and the figure for Mauthausen has been reduced from 2 million down to 38 thousand, etc., etc., etc.

Again, the actual figure matters to those sitting in prison for simply speaking the truth.

So how dare you, you POS, for saying that it doesn't matter.

In the United States, where I live, there are no laws sending you to prison for Holocaust denial or minimization.

When you get to the levels of 5 million or 6 million, it's just a statistic at that point. I don't believe those numbers are "exaggerated", but maybe some people "exaggerated", whatever that means. Based on my research so far, it seems like you could pretty easily defend 6 million in front of a reasonable audience.

You've called me a POS and inaccurately accused me of lying, so I'm less inclined to respond to you, but I will give you another chance if you are willing to be civil.

I personally disagree that people are speaking "the truth" when they say things like that, but it may be "their truth". That's my opinion at least.

I can't think of any reason off the top of my head as to why society might want to imprison people just for trying to speak "their truth", but I guess it depends on what their motivation is. If their intention is not good, then they might just want to abuse another person, even if they are speaking truth.

I don't get why people are so fixated on this though. I understand if you believe there was no genocide, but if you just think the numbers are exaggerated, why do people spend so much effort trying to prove that to the world? How does it benefit them by doing that?

Your asking me questions after cravenly refusing to answer aproximately 28 of mine?

[Keen]

I think this guy is talking to people like you CJ:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K04rF0H5q9g

[Keen]

Based on my research so far, it seems like you could pretty easily defend 6 million in front of a reasonable audience.

I will look at the strongest "revisionist" arguments there are out there myself. There are like a million different arguments though so it is better if I can take a look at the very strongest claims first. If they don't hold up, the less strong arguments almost certainly...

Is there a stronger argument than the issue of physical evidence - Yes. - or - No. - ??

Last chance coward.

[ConfusedJew]

Is there a stronger argument than the issue of physical evidence - Yes. - or - No. - ??

Last chance coward.

I will answer any question you want regarding the statistics and demographics. I don't want to discuss other issues right now so I would appreciate it if you would respect that.

You have to look at everything on a case by case basis and this is a serious subject so it requires serious consideration.

I will look at the case of the woman who is in prison for Holocaust denial and respond to that tomorrow.

I don't have answers to all of your question, not because I am afraid to answer them, but you are overloading me with a ton of random off-topic questions that I don't have the bandwidth to address right now.

I'm just asking questions here and you keep trying to fight me. If you actually cared about this topic and weren't trolling or trying to perpetuate hate, you would be trying to educate me rather than overloading me with disagreements and insulting me.

[Callafangers]

Yes, this is what I'm talking about but diffusion and dispersion can't account for the reported drop in population of 2/3 of the European Jewish population (6 million).

Here's what I see are the problems with the dispersion and diffusion hypothesis.

Six million Jews from Europe disappeared from 1939 to 1945. There's no documentation of millions arriving in new countries between 1941–45. It doesn't explain the massive depopulation of entire Jewish communities (e.g., Warsaw, Vilna, Salonika). Allied search efforts after the war were unable to find any trace of most deportees. If people had survived the war, they would be counted in censuses or community rosters around the world. There was no major demographic rebound of Jews. The historical documentation confirms deportation to killing centers, not resettlement or migration.

Dispersion is not supported by population records, migration data, or survivor research. The claim requires millions to disappear silently, with no arrival records, no new communities, and no family contact, which is implausible and contradicted by primary evidence.

Take Poland for example. Three million Jews disappeared from Poland and there were no records of millions of Jews fleeing Poland and entering other countries during 1941–45. No postwar Polish-speaking Jewish enclaves appearing elsewhere that could absorb even a fraction of 3 million people. Relief organizations like the Red Cross, HIAS, and the Jewish Agency had global reach and never recovered these missing people. Postwar census records in North America, Latin America, Palestine/Israel, and the USSR do not show a mysterious influx that could account for the missing millions. Of the 3.3 million Polish Jews documented at the beginning of the war, only 250,000 were found after the war.

Many of my ancestors came from Poland and a few of them emigrated to the US before the war started but many stayed behind and were killed.

All of this is interesting information but, for the sake of confirming or denying the 'Holocaust' narrative, we are already way off-base. It is you claiming that a certain, specific fate has come to certain Jews you deem as 'missing'. That puts the burden of proof firmly and necessarily in your camp. There is no shaking this.

To take a belt + suspenders approach, almost as a courtesy, revisionists are also offering reasoned explanations for patterns in Jewish destinations and outcomes. But this isn't necessary. The power dynamics post-war necessitate that the same victors peddling indisputably false and defamatory narratives about Germany (whether or not we accept the current 'Holocaust' narrative) also had the motive and means to manage and manipulate population movement and statistical data post-war.

Your insistence on a 'demographic collapse' as proof of genocide ignores the chaos of wartime Europe—mass displacement, destroyed records, border shifts, and Soviet control over vast territories where data was deliberately obscured or fabricated. Millions of people, not just Jews, 'disappeared' from censuses due to these factors. The assumption that 'missing' equals 'murdered' is a leap, not evidence. Where are the arrival records for millions of non-Jews displaced by the war? They’re often absent too, yet no one claims a genocide there.

Further, the Soviet Union’s post-war agenda included reshaping narratives to suit their ideological goals. They had every reason to suppress or distort Jewish survivor numbers—whether to downplay ethnic distinctions or to bolster the image of Nazi barbarity for political leverage. Allied and Zionist interests, as others have noted, often aligned with this silence, amplifying the 'six million' figure without forensic or documentary rigor. You’ve yet to address how such powerful actors couldn’t have skewed the stats you cling to.

If you’re serious about numbers, show us hard evidence tying these 'missing' directly to extermination—mass graves, cremation logistics, or Nazi orders matching your claimed scale. Absent that, your demographic argument is just a house of cards, built on presupposition, not proof. We’re waiting.

[Nessie]

...

The diffusion and dispersion theory doesn't hold up because there are clear records of Jewish migration before the war which don't even come close to the collapse in the demographic numbers.

...

The term Holocaust revisionist is the preferred descriptive on this forum, but denier is more accurate. If they were revisionists, they would be revising the mass killing of the millions of Jews arrested 1939-44, to what happened to them and where they were in 1944. But, as we all know, there is no evidence of millions of Jews still in the camps and ghetto that the Nazis built 1939-44. Accommodating and guarding such huge numbers of people would have left a lot of evidence.

What you will find is that the so-called revisionists do a little chronological skip, ignoring 1944 and jumping to 1945, to claim that the Jews went where they went. They just dispersed around the world, again, somehow, leaving very little evidence.

The mass murder deniers like evidence such as the clearly incorrect US almanac, which claims no drop in the Jewish population of Europe during WWII! They do not like the evidence from the Nazis themselves, or the countries they occupied or aligned to, who recorded, often, huge drops in their Jewish populations during the war. Interestingly, there are two exceptions to that, Denmark and Finland. Denmark was occupied by and for much of the war, Finland was aligned to the Nazis. Uniquely, they can show exactly where their Jewish populations were in 1944, since they did not cooperate with the Nazis and mostly, prevented their Jewish citizens from being arrested and sent to camps or ghettos.

There are other anomalies, Romania and Serbia. They were aligned to the Nazis, and they also recorded large drops in their Jewish populations. That is because they killed their own Jewish citizens. Anti-Semitism was strong, especially in Eastern Europe and the Nazis found that countries they occupied or aligned to, were, in the most part, happy to cooperate with the mass killings. Latvians and Lithuanians who fought with the Nazis, also joined them to shoot their Jewish citizens.

By 1944, all the countries occupied by or aligned to the Nazis, except Denmark and Finland, recorded drops in their Jewish populations. None deny that those drops were caused either by handing over the Jews to be transported away by the Nazis, or they were shot by their fellow citizens.

Hungary famously held out and refused to allow the arrest of its Jewish citizens, till its government was deposed and the Nazis took control in 1944. That is why so many Hungarian Jews died in the Birkenau gas chambers in 1944. Then, immediately after the Hungarian transports ended, the Lodz ghetto was cleared and closed, and it was the last ghetto. There were no more ghettos. Auschwitz's camp population was smaller in 1944 than it had been in 1943.

None of that is denied by any of the countries involved, from Norway to Greece, Estonia to France. They all say, that to one extent or another, they helped to identify, register, arrest, transport and even kill their Jewish citizens. If you want to make the so-called revisionist really uncomfortable, concentrate on 1944. How was it faked across Europe, with the cooperation of so many countries, that millions had been arrested, imprisoned in camps and ghettos, and killed 1939-44? Why did Denmark and Finland get to not be part of the fakery?