Kula vs Tauber on "Kula columns"

[HansHill]

Bombsaway’s antics demonstrate the point nicely.

The columns require wholesale unsupported changes and additions to their core design to approach anything resembling a viable delivery, retaining, and retrieval mechanism.

This clowning around is a further exercise in demonstrating it.

[bombsaway]

The slots are a more reasonable mechanism than a merry go round, but no I don't think either are definitively contradicted by Kula's testimony.

You are literally the only person on the planet who believes in the slots and slopes nonsense.

I hardly believe my design is actually what existed in reality - it's pure speculation, so if you want to attack it on those grounds that's legit. But I've said this many times before. It's possible the methods changed, it's possible the testimonies were confused to some degree leading to improper interpretations, it's possible mechanisms were left out. I would never offer my diagram up as serious history. It was an exercise in showing general feasibility.

[Archie]

I hardly believe my design is actually what existed in reality - it's pure speculation,

So ... you don't have a real position. You just know, in your heart, that there was some serviceable design, even though no one has any idea what it was. Okay.

I would never offer my diagram up as serious history. It was an exercise in showing general feasibility.

If these things existed in physical reality, then the primary source descriptions, particularly that of Kula, should be essentially correct and you shouldn't need to make up something else.

[bombsaway]

If these things existed in physical reality, then the primary source descriptions, particularly that of Kula, should be essentially correct and you shouldn't need to make up something else.

Kula's description very well might be correct and the whole column was extracted. In that case Tauber would have likely witnessed a different method or made an error in his error description, it's all possible.

[HansHill]

Kula's description very well might be correct and the whole column was extracted. In that case Tauber would have likely witnessed a different method or made an error in his error description, it's all possible.

Kula's description very well might be fabricated and the whole column was nonexistent. In that case Tauber would have likely fabricated a different method or made an error in his error description, it's all possible.

[bombsaway]

Yeah like I've said, you've identified a particular aspect in Holocaust historiography where we have to speculate about what happened and why the testimonies diverge.

But why is this a problem? You believe in a mass event involving millions of people which is speculative from top to bottom.

[HansHill]

But why is this a problem?

Because the defense offered up by Markiewicz, Green, Van Pelt, and by extension every other Holocaust proponent against revisionists, hinges centrally on the device to operate in this fashion.

The pellets MUST be delivered, retained, and retrieved using this mechanism. Failure on any of these points has direct repercussions on HCN exposure time and the chemical analyses, as well as execution times, poison gas and body removal.

Stop pretending this is an incidental point that we are nitpicking over - everything hinges on this mechanism and we (you included) cannot explain it.

[bombsaway]

But why is this a problem?

Because the defense offered up by Markiewicz, Green, Van Pelt, and by extension every other Holocaust proponent against revisionists, hinges centrally on the device to operate in this fashion.

The pellets MUST be delivered, retained, and retrieved using this mechanism. Failure on any of these points has direct repercussions on HCN exposure time and the chemical analyses, as well as execution times, poison gas and body removal.

Stop pretending this is an incidental point that we are nitpicking over - everything hinges on this mechanism and we (you included) cannot explain it.

Everything meaning what? The killing of a million Jews at Auschwitz?

[HansHill]

..and the size of the device they are supposed to go into is known (a 15 mm gap according to Kula's trial testimony)

Correct. An interesting facet to this aspect is that a slightly wider passage was given in his earlier deposition, of 25mm. It is this earlier, wider slot width, that Van Pelt chose to use in his designs, possibly because it is slightly more forgiving for his needs.

However, the thinner, less forgiving trial testimony came later, and is accompanied by a positive statement as to the intended purpose of "increase(d) the gas-evaporation surface". Given that a thinner passage will reduce gas evaporation surface, it seems he has it backwards, like much else in the Holocaust!

I have provided a handy set of study notes here to quickly enable comparisons on the key datapoints:

https://www.codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=25990#p25990

[Wetzelrad]

Because the defense offered up by Markiewicz, Green, Van Pelt, and by extension every other Holocaust proponent against revisionists, hinges centrally on the device to operate in this fashion.

Another way of saying "hinges centrally" is that it was "essential". The latter is what Robert van Pelt wrote:

These wire-mesh columns allowed not only the easy introduction of the cyanide-bearing cubes of calcium sulfate, but also their quick removal. The cubes continued to give up their hydrogen cyanide even after the poisoning process had ended after 20 minutes and no one was alive any more. The removal of these Erko cubes was essential for the smooth and continuous operation of the killing station. Zyklon B having been developed as a disinfestation agent, the duration of the evaporation had been fixed at 24 hours. Nits are difficult to get rid of and must be exposed to the cyanide for a long time. People, on the other hand, die quickly. With fresh transports arriving day by day, the SS insisted on the gas chambers being accessible right away after the death of all victims. The architects must have concluded that the removal of the still active Erko cubes would facilitate the cleaning-up operations.

From Neue Studien zu nationalsozialistischen Massentötungen durch Giftgas, p.210, as quoted and presumably translated by Carlo Mattogno in Inside the Gas Chambers, pp.109-110.

[Stubble]

And yet this miracle device doesn't even apply to the other supposed homicidal gassing installations...